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The U.S. ambassador to the Netherlands finally admits 'no-go zone' claims were false

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level 1
1.7k points · 8 months ago

He admitted he was "shocked" by statements he made into a fucking camera, a week into refusing to comment on ever having said it, and calling the implication fake news?

The best people

level 2
631 points · 8 months ago

He denied everything even with video evidence and called it fake news. It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth. How deep in denial do you have to be to honestly think everything against Trump and his administration is fake news when there are so many situations exactly like this one.

level 3

It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth.

Not really. If Trump claims fake news you know it's the truth...just one he either does not like or one he cannot publicly admit to.

Notice how he has never claimed fake news on something positive about himself?

level 4
[deleted]
7 points · 8 months ago

Trump has two verbal ticks that are really clear.

If someone else has said the truth? Fake news.

If Trump himself is lying? Believe me.

Not an original thought, I realize, but man, it is really stark.

level 5
[deleted]
11 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Also, "no one/most don't know," always means that he just learned something that most every other person of reasonable intelligence already knew, but is pretending that he just figured it out by himself and is now teaching everyone else.

e.g. "no one knew health care was so complicated" translates to "a bunch of people just told me stuff about health care and I had no idea what any of it meant."

edit: Honestly, when Trump said "no one knew health care was so complicated" my jaw dropped. (Even more than it dropped after he said he had the most people at inauguration of all time.) Because I realized he honestly thought that health care was simple, and that it was only evil Obama that made it so bad. And Trump honestly thought he could come in and say "health care for everyone for free!" and it would happen, only to have people be like "uhhhhh,no" and then Trump says "who knew it was so hard!"

level 6
[deleted]
2 points · 8 months ago

Forgot that one.

Someone should write a chrome extension to highlight these things and annotate accordingly.

level 7

What? Like something that scans for stuff he said and then provides a link to where he said it? Eg.:

"Nobody knew Healthcare was so complicated"

level 8
[deleted]
3 points · 8 months ago

No, although that's useful. An extension that reminds us of the definitions of the phrases he uses above. In his quotes, automatically replacing "believe me" with "President Trump indicated that this statement was a lie." Substituting "President Trump indicated that this statement was true" whenever he says "fake news."

level 9

Ah, thanks for clearing that up! :)

level 4
111 points · 8 months ago

Well, after reading Fire & Fury, I'd say it's more likely that Trump has been told by his advisers that the news is fake. Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity; and pretty much anything Trump does is adequately explained by stupidity.

level 5
[deleted]
178 points · 8 months ago

I think there's a lot of stupidity and malice.

level 6

Malicious stupidity if you will.

level 6

"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity, but don't rule out malice." - Hanlon's razor

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level 5
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level 6
62 points · 8 months ago

Or the fact that he's convinced the rest of the world that he doesn't know what he's doing, after amassing a massive real estate empire, and attending top universities, and listening to top advisers his whole life.

The problem is, you don't need to be smart or even know what you're doing to accomplish that. You just need money. Which Trump was born into, regardless of his claims that he was "self made". Money gets you into good schools, money allows you to purchase large amounts of real estate, money allows you to hire advisers who are competent, who can tell you how to invest your money to make more money.

This is the folly that got Trump elected in the first place. The belief that if a man is wealthy, it must mean he knows what he's doing. But in America, once you have a large enough amount of capital, making it grow isn't that difficult. The difficult part is getting that capital in the first place. It's super easy when you inherit it.

level 7

Plenty of fortunes are lost by people with money. in Trump's money making favor, he lacks compassion, had his 'wonderful' father as a teacher/role model, thinks the truth is what you can prove and is really good at his bully tactics. Of course it sounds like he is also willing to get into illegal acts like colluding with foreign governments and money laundering.

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level 6

Trump has always been very stupid, the only reason he has any wealth today is because :

  1. Daddy gave him millions of dollars as start up capital

  2. His "businesses" were just covers for his real business - money laundering for Russian mafia.

  3. He has declared bankruptcy 5+ times, by borrowing money he bever intended to pay back and then declaring bankruptcy. He is such a bad businessman that American banks and financial institutions have refused to loan money to him

  4. He created a fake charity to pay for personal expenses like his son's camp fees

  5. He refuses to pay his creditors. Anyone who does business with him never gets paid what they are owed.

  6. He refuses to pay any taxes and hides his wealth offshore

Trump is a crook through and through. He has never done an honest day's work in his life.

level 7

Oh you forgot about how his father illegally donated $3.5 million to his casino by walking in with the money in cash, buying chips worth $3.5 million, and then never cashing the chips out. He skirted banking laws by doing it this way and it made the casino that was operating at a deficit and losing money look profitable on paper so it could secure more financing. Then he declared bancruptcy to avoid repaying the new financers.

level 7
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level 8
38 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

If Trump is below average intelligence... and it's really thatt easy to pay no Tax, and to rip off American Financial Institutions without serving a single day in jail... then why aren't all rich people doing these things?

All rich people are doing these thing, in regards to taxes.

Many rich people are interested in long term accumulation of wealth, which requires good relation with your creditors. Trump only seems to be interested in maintaining a personal life style and an image of wealth.

Do you realize that his declaring bankrupsy, like you said, was planned all along, and that he managed to outsmart banks on MANY occasions, resulting in net profits?

I think we would absolutly would love some citations of his net profits. From my personal understanding, he has lost significant wealth since his inheretance. I do not have sitations for this understanding, so I would love something more solid.

Edit:citations*

level 9
Comment deleted8 months ago(0 children)
level 10

Sounds like the definition of new money. Ruin your long term financial credibility to get a lot of money in one go.

I guess the outcome of his investment is still being written. We'll see it sometime in the next 3 years.

level 9

Citations?

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level 9

I think low intelligence paired with no morals and willing to listen to advisors pretty much adequately explains all his past. He is stupid, but he has at some points had smart advisers who suggested immoral and potentially in some cases illegal actions which he had no problem doing, which meant even when he was failing he was able offload the problems, but he is fundamentally unfit when he is more than just the flashy figurehead who is used for his (previously popular) name on buildings.

level 8

The only reason he gets away with it is because of a) the mafia he launders money for, and b) his connections c) name recognition, d) he bullies and intimidates those who oppose him, e) corruption of USA govt departments like IRS, FBI who only go after easy targets (ie the little guy).

level 9
Comment deleted8 months ago(0 children)
level 10

I'd at least present the argument that a stupid person is much easier to control and manipulate as well as not even be aware that they're constantly being guided and manipulated. Having someone like that with money and power is a perfect candidate to act as a conduit for getting what you want. Now, not saying this is what's really going on or that what's been said isn't valid, just that it's another way to look at it.

level 8

If Trump is below average intelligence... and it's really thatt easy to pay no Tax, and to rip off American Financial Institutions without serving a single day in jail... then why aren't all rich people doing these things?

Lot of rich people do. Those who don't do it for the risk benefit ratio. Or because they plain don' want to break the law.

Also, why do you think bitcoin raised so much?

And if you mess up one bit, and say one wrong word at the wrong time... you go to jail.

Not if you are rich, thats the idea of ploutocracy.

Stop considering the law of common people apply to politicans, law enforcement, very rich people. Like in China, those people have their own laws and can do a lot of things that would get you life in jail.

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level 6

Trump was smart once. Now he's suffering from dementia and he's not smart anymore.

I think that if Trump was a bit smarter, a bit more diplomatic, a bit less vile and a bit less narcissitic, then he'd be perceived as an absolute monster. But because he's so stupid, coarse, vile and narcissitic, his awfulness doesn't register with people, or if it does they think it's an act because "surely the POTUS can't be that cartoonishly evil and incompetent, right?"

level 7
24 points · 8 months ago

He's seems to be going downhill, but I don't think he was ever intelligent. Tony Scwartz(the real author of Art of The Deal) spent 18 months with him in the 80's, and believes Trump was an imbecile back then.

level 7
Comment deleted8 months ago(0 children)
level 8

Trump has tweeted and said things that will very likely be used against him in a court of law soon by Mueller. That doesn't seem consistent with the "evil genius who pretends to be a moron" theory to me.

But you are right that "he was smart, now he has dementia" theory doesn't neatly explain 100% of his behavior either.

For what it's worth, I do agree that Bush was evil and smart and only pretended to be stupid.

level 9

Bush is fucking smarter than most. Even on his bad days, he us whip smart. I remember listening to a podcast that featured him as the subject... And was honestly pretty surprised at his intelligence level, and accomplishments.

That good ol boy shtick is just that. Shtick.

level 9
2 points · 8 months ago

We'll see if he gets caught in the end. As it stands, he's either the world's greatest conman, or the world's worst under the thumb of the world's best.

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level 6

I think he is genuinely stupid. It's those 'below' him that I believe are truly in charge - he is a pawn.

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level 5

I think this happens a lot more than we realize. I don't think Trump has a great grasp on reality, but what he does have is many snakes whispering in his ear to not believe what he sees on TV, only trust them. That coupled with his own petty vanity and his own joy of causing pain to others and its a bad combination.

level 5

While much of what Trump does can be attributed to stupidity, I think we'd get a poor and incomplete picture if we left out malice.

level 5

Trump lies about yesterday's weather, when he knows full well tens of thousands of people were there to see it, and probably thousands of those have video. You're giving him too much credit.

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level 3
[deleted]
13 points · 8 months ago

It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth.

I don't wonder about this at all. Its very clear.

level 3

How many times Trump called fake news when it was true? I'm gonna go with all of them.

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level 3
42 points · 8 months ago

Every time some idiot says fake news they fully know that thing is true. Those lines are for the hardcore rightwingnuts that believe anything and only vote white. Its been winning them elections for a decade or more in some parts of the country.

The majority have gone complacent deciding staying home on election day is easier than paying any real attention to current events. Our education system is fucked, same with our political system, judicial is heading that way, only thing we've got left is the press and they're too busy fighting for advertisement dollars to do consistent in depth journalism. Not that most notice when it does happen.

Its becoming increasingly difficult to see any realistic change to any of the above, we just keep going further down the "alternative facts" time line.... I really wish Doc and Marty would hurry up and fix this shit... Fucking flux capacitors!

level 4
9 points · 8 months ago

Every time some idiot says fake news they fully know that thing is true.

When they say fake news, what they really mean is "I'm one of you" to their fellow Trump loyalists. It's all about tribal loyalty, showing they will band together against reality if they need to.

The press is doing lots of in-depth reporting into Trump. Everything we know about Trump came through the press. The problem is too much of the audience tunes out most of the real news so they can glance at 10-second video clips and headlines in their social media feed. Or they watch entertainment-oriented news TV instead of reading some quality articles. Or they park themselves in front of Fox and its friends to have reality rewritten for them.

level 3

It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth.

How many times? Every. Single. One.

level 3

All of them.

level 3

It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth

Got a second hand on your watch?

level 3

makes you wonder how many times Trump

Uh, literally every time? His criteria for fake news was “truth that makes me look bad being reported”.

level 3

It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth.

Literally every time. I dont wonder, not even a little bit.

level 3
5 points · 8 months ago

It makes you wonder how many times Trump claimed "fake news" when it was actually the truth.

"fake news" is just negative news about Trump he doesn't like. As dopey as he is when he uses it, parrots like this ambassador are even worse for thinking it's a solid argument.

level 3

We are at war with Eastasia; we have always been at war with Eastasia.

level 3

Every time Trump Claims “fake news,” it’s true, accurate news that is damaging to him. No need to wonder.

level 3

Fake news is code for "I don't like this". If any news agency actually makes any kind of error, no matter how minor/quickly retracted, it's used to prove all the claims were right. In confusion is where they do best

level 3
2 points · 8 months ago

He denied denying it 3 minutes after denying it once he was shown the proof.

level 3
[deleted]
2 points · 8 months ago

nothing matters anymore

level 3
3 points · 8 months ago

Every. Time. And his minions

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level 2
29 points · 8 months ago

Thanks. I thought it was just me that read that as if he was surpised by his own words almost as if they were beyond his control. Fucking idiot.

On Friday Mr Hoekstra finally admitted to Dutch newspaper De Telegraaf that he had made the remarks, to a right wing gathering in the US, and said he was "shocked" by them.

"That was a wrong statement. That was just wrong," Mr Hoekstra said, adding that it was "clearly that was an inaccurate statement".

"That one shocked me personally ... because while you know there have been other issues in other countries in Europe, you know that has never been the circumstances here," he said.

level 3

That one shocked me personally ... because while you know there have been other issues in other countries in Europe, you know that has never been the circumstances here,"

Yeah... I call bullshut

Pete Hoekstra Is born in the Netherlands. You don't mix up your birth country with another one

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level 2

At least the Europeans are less timid about calling them on their bullshit until they admit it. hopefully that'll raise the quality over time.

level 2
75 points · 8 months ago

Doesn’t mater to the base. There’s no such thing as hating immigrants too much.

level 3

Ambassadors aren't supposed to do anything "for the base".

level 4

Hoekstra was a "journalist" for the far right wing blog Breitbart. His readers were the base voters for Trump

level 4

Not for US ambassadors.

Party before people.

level 5

I've got to disagree with that point. Just recently a US ambassador resigned.

level 6

Around a third of American ambassadors tend to be political appointees from the donor caste. This is true for all presidents, and has been for some time. Postings in Europe and East Asia tend to be the ones handed out as rewards, whilst the Middle East and Latin America tend to get the actual professionals.

What made the resignation in Panama remarkable is that the ambassador there was a careerist in the Foreign Service, and not a political one.

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level 3

Just look at what happened last time a bunch of immigrants showed up! I they took the land and killed all the locals! No wonder they are concerned!

/s <--- this should not be necessary

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level 2

Plus he also heavily implies that those things are happening in other countries, just not the Netherlands.

I don't think there is any country with Muslim ran enclaves burning politicians.

level 2
[deleted]
2 points · 8 months ago

You don’t realize he must have been talking about malmo sweden, or Paris, or Berlin Germany or acid attacks in London. It’s easy for fake news to edit interviews to pander to their narrative.

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level 2
[deleted]
2 points · 8 months ago

nothing matters anymore

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level 1
1.2k points · 8 months agoGilded1

No, he's not shocked he said that. The shock he had was when the Netherlands press corps wouldn't let him get away with his lies and then lying about lying.

level 2

Kudos to the Dutch and their reporters for not letting this shit fly!

level 3

Reminds me of Trump's first press conference in Germany where he gave his usual evading bullshit answer to questions and the entire gathered press just laughed at his stupidity.

level 4

When you have a country with a functional education system, that's what tends to happen.

level 5
159 points · 8 months ago

This needs more upvotes. Comprehensive access to higher education would solve like 90% of the problems in the US. Thank fuck I'm European.

level 6
[deleted]
116 points · 8 months ago

American unis are also very different. Like, I'm in a STEM major in Germany, and we do have quite a few narrow-minded elitits, too. But most students around here are less preoccupied with jobs and making money, at least for the first few years of studying, because we don't have to deal with abhorrent debt along the way.

Also, people usually don't live on campus, there's no gates, no campus police, random people can sit in lectures if there's enough space and nobody bats an eye. Quite a few pensioners just start studying something out of interest, because why not? For them it is something like 800€ per semester.

level 7
29 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Yup! Same thing in Colombia! If you have friends in say Economics and you're majoring in Architecture, you can still go to their lecture as long as there's free room. Some professors may not be okay with it for whatever reason (especially with smaller groups), but most will be completely fine. I've personally been to several different lectures unrelated to my field.

And I was also kinda shocked when I first started Uni and realized that one of my classmates was actually over 50 and already had a major degree. I got curious so I asked her why she decided to study music, after having already graduated from something else, and she just said something like "well I thought it'd be fun!"

level 7

What universities dont allow guest attendance if there's room? From California. Educated in 3 colleges. Never heard of banning non-enrolled attendees.

But yeah, the cost is absurdly high.

level 7
3 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago
  • people usually don't live on campus

Highly dependent on the university and where the school is.

  • there's no gates

Are you talking gates like a closed campus with security checking anyone trying to enter? I'd say that it's a pretty rare occurrence. Many campuses are located in urban areas and are highly interwoven into the surrounding communities.

  • no campus police

Highly dependent on the size of the university. Some of these are effectively enclaves of 50,000 people. Some of these have 50 students.

  • random people can sit in lectures if there's enough space and nobody bats an eye

Uh, auditing a class is pretty common as long as you don't disrupt the class.

The biggest difference between American and British/European universities is the structure of the course of study.

Edit: And US universities don't have bars which serve alcohol run by the university.

level 8

I believe UC Berkeley has an on-campus pub, and my university was a semi-dry campus - the only alcohol allowed was what was sold by campus catering.

level 6

It's not even higher education. The administration is attacking the public school system at the grade school level. That tax reform they just passed made it more expensive for teachers to buy supplies for their classes by removing a tax credit.

level 7
15 points · 8 months ago

That teachers have to personally buy essential supplies for teaching is a failure on the public school system on its own.

level 7

That didn't make it into the final bill.

level 8

The republicans don't fucking get credit for being prevented from doing something evil.

level 9

I'm not saying they should get credit, but on the same token we should focus on the horrendous things that are in the bill that they passed and not on stuff that wasn't.

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level 5

Here in the US we have a public education system where you’re obligated to pledge allegiance to a flag

level 6
26 points · 8 months ago

The problem with pledging allegiance to a flag is you end up going whichever way the wind blows.

level 7

Eh. Any way the wind blows doesn't really matter to me.

level 8

To me?

level 5
Comment deleted8 months ago(6 children)
level 6
[deleted]
64 points · 8 months ago

The problem is education.

level 7

I think you two are both right tbh

level 8

The solution to radicalization is education

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level 8

"you got radicalization in my ignorance!"

"No, you got ignorance in my radicalization!"

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level 4

Do you have a video clip of that? I'd like to see it for schadenfreude purposes

level 3
26 points · 8 months ago

I don't know if my country deserves props as much as the US should get... unprops(?) for not doing the same.

This kind of behaviour just goes against all common sense over here.

level 4
Comment deleted8 months ago(1 child)
level 5
4 points · 8 months ago

To be fair, 40% would statistically speaking still be common.

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level 2

This...american media just changes the subject when you call something fake news.

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level 1

This is what a free press does to politicians who lie.

level 2

Yet he got into office and the people believed in and he promoted harmful ideology and caused significant damage to society.

It's too late now. The damage is gone. There is no justice.

Everything this administration is doing must be rolled back on and all people goberning with them should be disowned and jailed.

level 3
38 points · 8 months ago

His getting into office isn't exactly something the free press could have prevented. It was a choice made by Trump. Once Trump got into power, no amount of free press would have stopped it. Hoekstra could have eaten live kittens for dinner, and still would have gotten into office.

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level 1

Too little, too late. He lost a lot of goodwill that will be really hard for him to win back.

The Dutch press will show these recordings every time he will be in the news, because that is how he entered our consciousness.

level 2
119 points · 8 months ago

Good, and the rest of the world needs to follow suit. Hound them with this, never let it go, never give them breathing room to draw the next breath that will become the next lie.

level 3
11 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Breathing room is something afforded to those I believe harbor me no lll will.

level 2

Seems like "ambassador" is one of those jobs where, if you hear nothing about it, he's doing a good job. The fact that this guy's fuckups have such a high news profile is really legendary.

level 3
3 points · 8 months ago

at least it does have a high news profile -- seriously, why is this at all acceptable? All of this bs needs to start being called out extremely, not just with a shrug.

level 3

The previous us ambassador to Finland is pretty well known for being an awesome guy. He even stayed here after his term ended and has been working with local businesses. Definitely a positive thing for the us’ image here.

level 2

Would love to see the Dutch reject him and ask for a replacement ambassador. Too bad diplomacy works in the rest of the world, sometimes manners need to be put aside.

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level 1
174 points · 8 months ago

This is the problem with Trump administration officials. It's not that they get things wrong. It's their attitude about these things.

First, he didn't just say that the report was wrong. He called it "fake news." In a world where there is so much actual fake news, it's appalling to call anything done by actual journalists fake news.

Then, when it was absolutely clear that he had said the things he was accused of having said, he simply was not able to say "I made a mistake, and I regret it." Simple as that. People know that people make mistakes, and it is a sign of being a normal, healthy person to be able to say, "Yeah, I got that one wrong. Sorry."

But this administration seems to have a ban on that sort of thing. And that's what's so insulting about people like Sean Spicer and Sarah Sanders. And of course, Trump himself.

level 2
54 points · 8 months ago

My main reason for hating the term "fake news" is because of how much it is used by people to dismiss things they simply don't like or don't want to accept. It's practically a stalling technique for childish adults who hope bad things just go away.

level 3

You are fake news! Lol, I joke, I share your sentiment though, probably not just The U.S. but other countries have issues with yellow journalism. I wish it would be sorted out or verified with methodical professionalism, rather than fake news!, you're fake news, you too!. Know what I mean?

level 2

You make it sound like they are constantly just making innocent mistakes. They are not, they are lying and propagandizing on purpose. This guy just tried to do the same in a country where it didn't work and after weeks of being relentlessly hounded tried to weasel his way out as inconspicuously as possible.

It has nothing to do with 'getting things wrong' sometimes and not being humble or whatever, it is an active campaign of deception.

level 2
46 points · 8 months ago

And when they do correct themselves, they do it halve assed, claiming there was a slight error (in this case geographical in nature) but the core information was still valid.

THe correct follow up question would have been "And which country did you confuse "your second country" with".

They are always trying to have it both ways. On the one hand because of his personal history he is a prime candidate to work in the Netherlands, on the other he just "slightly confused" the Netherlands with another unnamed country, which also doesn't have no go zones and burning politicians.

level 3

This was our exact response in /r/TheNetherlands to the original article. The article was by De Telegraaf (Telegraph) if I recall correctly, which to to be fair isn't know for their critical journalism. I'm pretty sure the ambassador knew that, and deliberately chose them to "rectract" his statements.

level 2

they're burning all bridges, even if he gets impeached now or sits his full term, the next president is just fucked cause he's gonna have to deal with mostly just repair jobs.

i do not envy that person one bit (not that i'd like to be the US president in the first place)

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level 1
206 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

The headline is misleading. He said that he confused the netherlands with another country. What country? Isis?

And the fact that he chose to release his explanation through “De Telegraaf” a populist , rightwing tabloid that has historically supported the nazi’s in wwii says enough.

level 2
112 points · 8 months ago

Which country?

Any other paper would've asked this question, which is why he went to de Telegraaf..

level 3
10 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Exactly!

level 4

...to not be held accountable for an obvious lie of an answer?

level 5

Exactly. If he was truly remorseful for his actions he would’ve gone to an actual news paper / agency and not a tabloid that is known to sacrifice the truth as long as it pushes a certain agenda.

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level 2
Original Poster22 points · 8 months ago

On Friday Mr Hoekstra finally admitted to Dutch newspaper De Telegraaf that he had made the remarks, to a right wing gathering in the US, and said he was "shocked" by them.

"That was a wrong statement. That was just wrong," Mr Hoekstra said, adding that it was "clearly that was an inaccurate statement".

"That one shocked me personally ... because while you know there have been other issues in other countries in Europe, you know that has never been the circumstances here," he said.

He hasn't stated that everything is rosy across Europe, but in respect to the country he is the ambassador to he is retracting his statements. It took him far too long and I don't agree with everything he said in it, but I don't think the title is misleading - he admits that the no go zones he previously spoke of do not exist in the Netherlands, and that what he said was 'just wrong'.

level 3
42 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Go to r/thenetherlands and read the original article. I’ll quote the relevant piece for you

Ik heb landen door elkaar gehaald. Ik had het fout, en ik weet niet meer hoe dat heeft kunnen gebeuren. Ik weet wel: het was fout.”

Translation: I had the countries mixed up. It was inaccurate and I don’t know how this could have happend. I know one thing: it was wrong.

An more accurate headline would be along the lines “Hoekstra claims he mixed up the netherlands with another country and retracts his statements”.

level 4

I think wrong would be a better word than inaccurate.

level 5
9 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

I don’t think so. If he had said “Het was fout” then I would use wrong, because wrong implies a sense of wrong doing. The way he phrased it was more in the lines of that it happens, but just not in the Netherlands.

He said “ik had het fout” which means “ I was mistaken”. He didn’t say “ik was fout” then we could use wrong. He isn’t wrong for spreading propaganda, he’s just saying he misspoke.

The information was inaccurate, but he doesn’t feel remorseful. So that’s why you can’t use wrong in the translation.

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level 2

I don't think it's fair to bring up 70 year old politics to smear an organization. Now if you wanted to say they're supporting neo Nazis to this day, that's another thing, but there's a big gap between populist right and neonazi.

level 3
46 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Indeed there is. That’s why I called it a populist, right wing tabloid that historically has supported the nazi party, not a neo nazi paper. The parent company of the telegraph owns geenstijl and that is the dutch equivalent of breitbart.

It’s a low effort tabloid that pushes a divisive agenda.

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level 1

"Yes, I'm totally shocked that I said those things and was recorded. That was incorrect. Just shocking, I tell you. Totally not my fault."

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level 1
28 points · 8 months ago

It took quite a fair bit of time and persistence, but finally, the truth has prevailed. The Dutch are nothing if not persistent when something catches their attention. The ambassador should just have relented right then and there. He could have saved face, at least. Now, he'll always be remembered as someone who just blurts out whatever lies comes into mind, and blames the other side when he's found out. In other words, a Trump crony. A shill. He will find no friends outside of the PVV and the FvD crowd.

level 2
17 points · 8 months ago

Half assed truth. The truth is the story was made up entirely to rile up idiots, and it wasn't just a geographical misshap.

These fuckers act like these half excuse apologies should fix anything and then we can leave it behind us as if nothing happened.

level 2

The truth didn't really prevail, because he said it'd happened somewhere else in Europe, which is probably also bullshit.

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level 1

As far as I know, in the interview he said he mixed up the Netherlands with some other countries aka the "but it was still true but somewhere else" defense.

level 2

So he didn't correct the lie, he just diverted it. He's still a lying piece of shit.

Which makes him a perfect ambassador on behalf of Trump.

level 3

And sadly he went to the Fox News reporters of The Netherlands so they never pressed him demanding to know which country he meant then. So now he walks away and next time they ask him which country he meant all he'll say is he apologized for the matter and wants to move one.

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level 1

Fine, now lets refuse him.

Yep, foreign country can refuse diplomats. Holland should refuse this one. Diplomacy is about real problems, not debatting fairy tales.

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level 1

You can have your own opinions but you can't have your own facts, Trumptards...

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level 1

Honestly, I am finding it harder and harder to be comfortable, much less proud, to be an American. The fact we pull shit like this so much that it's only surprising when the guy backs down is just... humiliating. I'm eligible to vote for the first time this year, and I can only pray that my voice makes a difference, and I can help move my country in a direction where I can proudly declare my citizenship for the country that is my home.

level 2

As a Canadian, I'm thankful that you think this way. Now, convince ten of your voting-age friends to think critically, and have them all do the same.

level 1
12 points · 8 months ago

fuckn asshole. That's all there is to note about this administration -- a bunch of lying, fuckin' assholes. Just say it like it is, right, Dumpy?

level 1

you know there have been other issues in other countries in Europe, you know that has never been the circumstances here

So can we ask him now which country politicians were being burned alive? Or are the press just going to accept that he just named the wrong country?

level 1

Right wingers across the US are now confused and still uninformed.

level 2

Guarantee you they aren’t following this news, and if they are, it’s “fake news” and the Europeans are just “out to get us” etc etc etc, continue echo chamber etc

level 3
8 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

Not even necessary. He was right all along, except for that minor "Netherlands" thing. It's easy to confuse when ALL of Europe only has burning Politicians left and 50% of all areas are black hole like no go zones.

So he was a bit of geographically, He couldn't even believe himself he made that error. Good catch Journalists, nothing gets by you!

Edit: Does this really need a sarcasm tag?

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level 1

The incompetence of inviting all these journalists and not being prepared for this question!

Professionals at the US state department must be grinding their theeth in frustration

level 2

There aren’t any left to be frustrated. They’re dropping like flies and not being replaced since basic competency offends Trump. He hates it when everyone in the room is smarter than he could ever be.

level 2

Professionals at the US state department

they would if they had any. Since the new admin has come in there has been a mass exodus, firing, and employment freeze. The department is a shell of what it was.

level 1

Finally someone from the fox bubble is forced to admit the real world and facts exist. Too bad it took weeks of concentrated national humiliation and mockery.

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level 1

They hounded the truth out of him. Fucking good. This needs to happen more.

level 1

Typical piece of shit representing Cheeto!

level 1

US media needs to adopt this approach. Broadcasters like NPR should lead the charge. It'll be really hard to accuse NPR of being fake news. They are impeccable.

Remember to support your local pbs and NPR stations, kids.

level 2
[deleted]
7 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

It'll be really hard to accuse NPR of being fake news.

No it isn't. NPR is fake news. See. That was easy. right wing conservatives CONSTANTLY call NPR fake new and liberal elites, libtards, etc, etc.

The fact that NPR is so objective scares the more sane conservatives, because they know NPR is telling an objective thing (as much as there can be in most cases), and the republicans can't win if the truth is being reported to the voters.

If NPR was on TV and got even half as popular as MSNBC, Trump would be calling it fake news a dozen times a day. Luckily, Trump probably doesn't even know NPR exists.

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level 1

Perfect ambassador for the DJT administration. Dishonest and incompetent, but a DJT crony.

level 1

What a fucking loser. The entire Trump admin and the Republican party has no integrity or shame.

level 1

Mr. Shirt Term Memory Loss. "Shit! What just came out of my mouth?"

level 1

The problem with these no go zone statements is that redditors who have never been to the country start using it. I remember an American saying England had no go zones too. Lol

Every country has dangerous areas compared to others... But all I know is the police will come to all areas when needed. Every area has a police force ffs...

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level 1

Lol - these fucking politicians have to be forced to do the job they swore they would, when they took the oath of office - fuck them. Fucking dipshits are answerable to the public - answer the fucking question - you don't have the right to ignore questions if you are a paid public servant...

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level 1

That part where the reporter made him read the John Adams quote on the mantle-piece, which was about Adams' hope that only "honest and wise men ever rule under this roof."

And then asked him this:

"If you're truly an honest and wise man, could you please take back the remark about burned politicians or name the politician that was burned in the Netherlands?"

God it was GORGEOUS. That's probably the best murder by words I've ever seen irl by a journalist.

If anyone wants to know, John Adams spent time in the Netherlands as Ambassador so this was a real piece likely from his time there or maybe another place he spent in Europe as an Ambassador.

level 2

That deserved a standing ovation!

level 1

translation: i wasn't supposed to say the actual positions of the state dept. out loud, on the record, in public... just behind closed doors, while misrepresenting the agenda to the people to gain advantage

level 1

"That was a wrong statement. That was just wrong," Mr Hoekstra said, adding that it was "clearly that was an inaccurate statement"

Said by the man who made the statement!

Exceptional job by the Dutch reporters! They all banded together and cornered him and demanded accountability!

level 1

American Media should learn from them. This is the role of the media. Present out a common platform of verifiable facts and figures. Opinions, agreements, disagreements, etc can and will always be there, but truth should be the bedrock.

level 1
34 points · 8 months ago · edited 8 months ago

He admitted it because of relentless hounding of the local press. Our press corps could learn something from them.

As one of their reporters told him, "This is Norway the Netherlands, you have to answer questions here."

edit: oops

level 2

Netherlands, not Norway.

level 3

Either way they're white, GET EM IN!

level 3

So shithole!

level 2

"This is Norway, you have to answer questions here."

I'm not sure even the ambassador was that confused

level 2

it also helped that every other reporter in the room backed up the question. when he went silent and his press secretary or whoever kept asking "are there any other questions" EVERYONE said yes, but he hasn't answered the question. or "this is not how this works here." in america the next reporter would have just asked a different question cause they would want their publication or network to have their question answered.

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level 2
20 points · 8 months ago

Well then everybodies confused as he is in The Netherlands

level 1

Kick his lying ass out of your country immediately - you've seen what happens in the U.S. - a lying fucker makes it big and then all of a sudden all the assholes he's near turn into lying fuckers.

It's a disease. The Netherlands needs to boot that lying fuck while they're still uninfected.

level 2
2 points · 8 months ago

Pffft. My country is not such a shithole that this nobody can have influence here. This isn't America.

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level 1

Trumpism is racism. End of story.

level 2
51 points · 8 months ago

End of story.

No, no. There's a lot more to the story than simple racism.

level 3

You're right. It's also the deliberate spreading of propaganda and keeping the base "angry".

level 3
25 points · 8 months ago

Yeah, there's a whole bunch of xenophobia, unwarranted narcissism, corruption, and incompetence involved too!

level 3

Complicated racism?

level 4
5 points · 8 months ago

delux racism, racism +... the best racism

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level 1

I wish the American media did this to Trump and huckaby sanders...they just ask a question and roll over when they avoid it.

level 1

What a dumb retarded idiot!! I guess God and Mother Nature was not kind to him regarding his minimal IQ which seem's to be on par with his supreme leader the Drumpf.

level 1
2 points · 8 months ago

Attaboy.

level 1

"Sorry, wrong country. And it wasn't a muslim, it was a buddhist monk. And he set himself on fire. I saw a black and white picture." Fucking douche. Piss off.

level 1
Comment deleted8 months ago(6 children)

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level 1

But not in France or Sweden

level 1

Deep State agents forced him to deny it or they would hurt his family! Fake news! /S

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level 1

How much longer until Trump gets impeached? Anyone want to start a betting pool?

level 1

F’n moron,,, damn embarrassment.

level 1

It took a while, but it seems like he has come to his senses. Visiting the "worst"neigbourhood the Netherlands has to offer and talking to a Muslim there is a lot for a guy like this i imagine. Hope his extended stay will help him soften up a bit and see there are less conservative, more effective ways to achieving stuff like less abortions and lower crime rates.

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level 1

You can't take back being an absolute turd.

level 1

American slimebag

level 1

With the way Trump’s actions have been nothing but escalating in recent times, and people’s opinions of his administration are worsening, and now with this Netherlands ambassador business, I feel like this is building up to something insane happening in some months maybe years, like Trump admitting to some of the very serious alegations he’s had against him or something.

level 1
Comment deleted8 months ago(22 children)
level 2

Do you have an article about it that you can share with me?

level 3

google area 51

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