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1 day ago
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ADC (July 2018, 3rd week): Dün - Eros

This is the Album Discussion Club! July's theme is solitary albums.

/u/Vessiliana wrote:

This French avant-prog album, by a band that played shows with Magma and very nearly joined the Rock in Opposition movement, is their only release, and it had only around 1,000 copies in its original pressing. The sound is rich, as Zeuhl tends to be, and the album full of the mysterious sci-fi aspects of the Dune series by Frank Herbert, which inspired the band's very name.

Dün - Eros

Stickied postModerator of r/LetsTalkMusic

General Discussion, Suggestion, & List Thread - Week of July 12, 2018

All weekly threads (including this one) will always be posted at 10:00 AM EST, so look out for them then.

Talk about whatever you want here, music related or not! Go ahead and ask for recommendations, make personal list (AOTY, Best [X] Albums of All Time, etc.)

None of the usual subreddit rules for comments will be enforced here, apart from one: Don't be a dick.


Let's talk - "Un-popular" music.

So there are some genres of music that are generally considered part of popular music and that are rooted in popular music traditions, even though they strongly reject the music industry and any real pretensions towards commercial success.

For instance, you have the EDM genre "witch house", which deliberately tries to avoid popularity by using more-or-less unsearchable track and album names:

Common typographic elements in artist and track names include triangles, crosses and Unicode symbols, which are seen by some as a method of keeping the scene underground and harder to search for on the Internet as well as references to the television series Twin Peaks and Charmed. (Wiki)

Black metal is another genre that's rooted undoubtedly in popular music (metal, which in turn is a genre of rock) but that strongly emphasizes being underground and not seeking fame or attention. Even punk rock probably fits in this category.

So - are these still popular music genres if they draw from popular music genres but reject celebrity and the industry in favor of staying underground?


What album keeps getting better with each full play?

Conversely, which album do you find that after more and more listens, it seems to hold less and less depth/enjoyment?

For me, an album lately that I've found that just keeps getting better with every full listen, is Mastodon's Emperor of Sand. While individual songs on there grow with their depth and enjoyment with the same listens, the album as a whole just seems to reach new levels of clever. I'm always finding a new sound, or a composition, that I hadn't noticed before. I keep going back to it on a regular basis, and I'm never left disappointed.


Whatever happened to piano rock?

From the birth of rock and roll, the piano has been an important instrument, for instance the iconic music of Jerry Lee Lewis and Little Richard, and although piano rock has always been less prominent than guitar rock (and I might be a hypocrite for saying this as I just recently started piano lessons after playing guitar since I was a child) it has always been there, but it's faded out in the last few decades, and the last big piano rock band was Queen. I spoke about this with a few friends and they suggested that it might be because a piano is much harder to transport than a guitar, that is true but it is not much more difficult than a drum kit and certainly less so than than a quarter stack or more of tube amps, and even though digital piano samplers don't sound as good as a real piano, high end digital keyboard models certainly come close enough that it's acceptable for a smaller (in terms of fame/popularity) band playing live at smaller venues.

The piano is still heard quite often on the radio, but mostly in pop ballads, which is odd because it's so versatile, why do you think that the piano has lost its status as a lead rock and roll instrument?


Why do we care about cohesion?

Whether or not an album/song is cohesive or not seems to be important to a lot of people. I personally don't quite understand this.

If a song is all over the place with abrupt transitions, some people criticise that. I have no problem with things like this. If a song changes very abruptly, I usually just go "whoa, that was surprising" and proceed to enjoy the music. I don't see anything bad about it really. I don't come across song structures that make a song worse for me. They might exist somewhere in this world, sure, but in the music I listen to it's just not an issue I come across. If a song sounds like two different songs played one after another I might just think of it as two pieces of music. I see no problem with it: other people sometimes seem to however.

When it comes to albums, there has just never been a moment when lack of cohesion has lessened my enjoyment of a record. No matter how weird or "jarring" a change or musical decision, I usually just think "okay, they decided to do it this way, interesting" and keep enjoying the music. As long as the music itself is good, I don't mind things like this. Again, there might be albums whose lack of cohesion would be so bad it would bother me, but so far I haven't come across one. I have never felt the feeling of a song order being truly bad for instance. I might like a consistent album, I might like an "all over the place" album: to me they're just different things, neither being better or worse really.

I'd like to know how other people feel about this so as to understand other people's perspectives on this better.

How does a non-cohesive song or album feel to you? What is it about you that bothers you? Why are songs or albums even supposed to be cohesive or "make sense"? How does consistency in itself make a song or an album better?

Essentially: why does one song or album have to be "one thing", why can't it be two or three things for instance?

I'm not trying to sound like my opinion is better than anybody elses, I'm just genuinely curious about how other people feel about this.


What is your favorite style of lyrics and why?

Do you like political lyrics? Simpler lyrics about love/breakups/dancing? More poetic lyrics even if they don't necessarily make sense.

Personally I like lyrics that tell a personal story and make you invested (many of which can also involve love/breakups/dancing) or songs that have the songwriter reflect on a non political aspect of their outlook on life. I find these types more emotionally engaging. Frank Turner and Jason Isbell have a lot of great songs in these styles (although Frank Turner's most recent album is more political).


Bands That You Once Held in High Esteem That Do Nothing for You Anymore

I used to LOVE Social Distortion and Mike Ness. So much so that I got a tattoo and saw them on all dates of their 2011 Australian tour.

I loved the old school Americana and country influences they incorporated into their music and always said they deserved more recognition.

I think it was around 2015 when I last really listened to them and enjoyed it. Recently I tried again and just couldn't get past how one dimensional and self indulgent Mike Ness was and couldn't take the music seriously.

I still listen to a lot of similar music so I know this is not simply growing out if a genre.


Given the ability and opportunity, what kind of music or album would you record?

I read about the making of The Beach Boys "Pet Sounds" and it mentioned one of Brian Wilson's inspirations was things he'd thought about as a child. I've often thought about this myself and have this inkling inside me to do something similar. I can't play an instrument nor can I sing so it's really out of the question but, have you felt this way?


Do you fault musicians for not keeping up with musical trends?

I'm always playing music of some sort, but I'm very private about the music that I compose and record myself. Last week I gave my friend a copy of the tape that I've been working on for the last few months. He told me that he liked it a lot but also said that the music sounded like it was from another era, I asked if that was a bad thing and he said no and while he's right from my POV it's been stuck in my head. My music does sound "old," some of that is a conscious choice, I recorded on tape on 4 tracks with ribbon and tube mics and mixed it down to mono because I wanted that sort of sound, but in another sense it's just the fact that the music and artists that inspire me are from a long time ago. I like listening to new artists (though many of them, like Vulfpeck and Greta Van Fleet, have a really old style as well) but they don't inform how I compose and play my music as much.

As a listener, is keeping up with musical trends something that you look for? Is not doing so something that you'll fault an artist for?

I decided to post on here (using this account, as I am a regular commenter here) because I know that the taste of this forum leans more toward really new, "innovative" and avant garde music.


Let's talk: Yacht rock

For the past two years i have been obsessed with arguably the smoothest sounds of the 70s and 80s, that later got named Yacht rock.

The era of Yacht rock (originally and still often called soft rock) lasted from the mid 70s to around mid 80s. It was done by professional bands, production was great and included some finest, catchiest melodies of it's time mixing blue eyed soul with some doo-wop, funk, rock and jazz. After Yacht rock's popular years it was often ridiculed, and i admit, sometimes for a good reason. The musicians might look a bit funky and by first listening everything sounds very soft and corny, but after diving in you can find some of the finest groove and low key great musicianship from many songs. There's so much overlooked things in music, but i think Yacht rock got one of the worst treatments. I guess everyone had pretty bad hangover from the 80s.

The genre has got some nice lift to it's reputation in 2000s and these days artists like Mac Demarco (a huge fan of soft rock) and Thundercat use elements of the genre. Ed Motta also made a whole album dedicated to the sound. Many rap producers from MF DOOM to J Dilla have also used Yacht rock in their sampling. MF DOOM's great Gas grawls actually got me into Steely Dan in the first place.

Some of my favorites for people new to Yacht rock:

Ace - How long

Steely Dan - Hey Nineteen

Michael McDonald - I keep forgettin'

Cristopher Cross - Ride Like The Wind

Ned Doheny - Get It Up For Love

Toto - Hold The Line

Here's also a great spotify playlist by the creators of the web show Yacht Rock, that really show's how much variety there is to the style.

Numero group, a record company specialised in all things obscure, mostly old school soul, has also made two collections of more obscure soft rock, called "Seafaring strangers" and "W2NG" that i can recommend to people who already are into this stuff. The songs are sometimes a bit more disco or funk than actual yacht rock, but still.

What's your relationship with this genre? Do you love it? Do you hate it? Some more obscure recommendations are also more than welcome!

I know nothing better than having a cup of coffee in the morning and listening to some Yacht sounds to soothe me to a new day!


Why do some people judge music on factors other than whether or not they enjoy the feelings that it gives them?

Often in conversation, in really any genres but especially about the rapidly changing scenes of hip-hop and electronic music, people will mention reasons for disliking music that take priority over whether or not they actually enjoyed the feelings that the music was giving them! Does that seem a bit crazy to anyone other than me?

Now, obviously people can relate to art on multiple levels, which is one of the beauties of art to begin with; that being said, I don't understand the mentality of someone who allows their conscious thoughts about context/history, personality, society, etc. to take precedence over the actual feelings that the music is giving them. To me, music is primarily a tool to capture and deliver the subtleties of different moods and energies; I just don't see the point of wasting my own enjoyment of that energy by judging the art based on surface-level, societal thoughts before I've allowed myself to simply feel it.

I've heard people mention that a song sounds/feels amazing but is too simple. Or that it's enjoyable, but it's not fresh or novel enough. Or that the song sounds fantastic, but they don't like the person who made it. Or that it's great, but they don't think that it's "genuine." All sorts of other comments, of course. How can these factors remain relevant to anyone who is truly listening to music in the moment and letting it affect them with sound alone?

Small note to clarify what I mean by “enjoy”: You can enjoy feelings that aren’t traditionally considered pleasant, which is why genres like aggressive punk and death metal can be so fun to listen to. When I say “Enjoy the feelings that music is giving you,” I mean just enjoy whatever feeling that may be. Could be a tense, aggressive feeling or all sorts of others.


Lets talk listening to movie soundtracks

My friend from another country has a CD in his car with a lot of songs, and he tells me that they all come from movie soundtracks, as he says that movies are probably the main source of music in that country. That got me thinking. Do you ever listen to certain movie soundtracks when you want to listen to music? Like, maybe a movie has a really good score or they chose a bunch of good songs that got you into the band or something like that. Also in general, what role do movie soundtracks play in people’s music listening if at all in your opinion?


Artists without many (or any) amazing albums, but whose "greatest hits" are worth listening to

Some artists really put out a lot of good music in the form of singles, but put together only one, a few, or maybe even no great albums. I have recently been thinking about who might fall into this category based on my collecting a master list of “greatest” albums and artists. Going through what is really a tremendously long list already, there are a few names that quickly stood out to me as being lacking on the albums: Bon Jovi, Billy Joel, The Bee Gees, ABBA, Earth Wind and Fire, Lionel Richie, etc. and much of contemporary pop (e.g. Rihanna was my first instinct).

Bon Jovi in particular was the artist that struck me as being a bit surprising. Slippery When Wet from 1986 was on Rolling Stone’s list of the 50 greatest hair metal albums. It’s also in the book 1,001 Albums You Must hear Before You Die (I don’t have that list compiled yet). Besides this one album however, Bon Jovi (and the solo efforts of Jon Bon Jovi) seem to not be nearly as praised. This is in spite of their 1988 follow up album New Jersey going 7x platinum, having 5 top 10 Billboard Hot 100 hits (2 #1s), and being the first American album released in the USSR.

Yet if we look at a greatest hits compilation of Bon Jovi such as the 2010 release, what we see is the following: 3 songs from Slippery when wet, 1 from Crush, 2 from Have a Nice Day, 4 from New Jersey, 1 from The Circle, 1 from Blaze of Glory, 1 from Cross Road, 1 from Bon Jovi and 2 new tracks. Whether this is or is not an adequate Bon Jovi greatest hits collection is beyond the point.

What is more interesting is that there is certainly a smattering of Bon Jovi tracks that are worth listening to from across the spectrum of their career from Runaway on the 1984 self-titled debut through 2009’s We Weren’t Born to Follow.

Bon Jovi can’t be the only artist that this applies to. While it’s against rules to ask for a list or anything like that, I’m wondering what other artists people might have in mind regarding this general topic: artists whose greatest hits (or compilation albums) are really solid efforts in spite of having few or no classic, or very highly regarded albums.


Why is it that in the official "Back to Black" video/recording by Amy Winehouse, they bleep "blow" but not "puff"?

I just realized this listening to it for the first time today and I'm a little puzzled. Like I had definitely noticed that they bleeped "dick" at the beginning presumably so it could get automatic radio play, but why "blow"? Was it simply banned in some sort of FCC (or British version whatever) rule, or do y'all think there's a more sentimental/ deep reason?


Do you feel interested in "Weird" music?

There's a lot of tracks that I've come across that are weird in my opinion, but I still love them. I feel Funkadekic's debut album Free Your Mind is fantastically weird. Tracks like Eulogy and Light and Free Your Mind are truly experimental funk and it shows in its noise and Distortion.

Others that come to mind are Captain Beefhearts "Trout Mask Replica" and some tracks off of his debut "Safe as Milk" like Dropout Boogie and Electricity

And some other mentions including The Beatles Revolution Number Nine

Posted by
4 days ago

Biggest fall from grace? (Artists who dipped in quality the biggest)

The title is pretty standard and self explanatory but here’s my example to get the ball rolling and I apologise for it being a rather obvious one: Weezer.

So, and not a hot take at all here, Blue Album and Pinkerton are two of the best records of the 90’s. It’s hard to recall an act starting off as well as they did, especially with a real tonal shift between the aforementioned albums that I’m sure made them an exciting album to follow at the time (1996 baby right here).

Green album is a good album in its own right but the decade that followed was pretty bad which isn’t exactly an undocumented stance. I’d have to put it down to Make Believe being the point where hopes were the lowest, even if Raditude is arguably the worst of their catalogue.

Thankfully the band showed their first few albums weren’t just a fluke with Everything Will Be Alright In The End and White Album (yup, Pacific Daydream happened, we get it) but I want to know what other acts (popular and not so popular) fall into the same category.


What instrument would you like to hear more of in popular music?

Different genres seem to have standard instrumentation that is relatively static and essential to the sound that transcends the ages, the electric guitar in rock and the trumpet in jazz for instance, but there are also trends in popular music instrumentation that ebb and flow throughout the ages (the Hammond Organ in the late 60s and early 70s, the late 80s/early 90s saxophone solo etc.) and some instruments that are just unheard of outside of a single genre of music, you're unlikely to hear an accordion in anything other than polka, and you won't the find the euphonium or sousaphone outside of a brass/marching band, for instance — what instrument would you like to hear more of in popular music?

For me it's the lap steel or pedal steel guitar. It's mostly limited to country and Hawaiian music but IMO it could be an incredibly versatile instrument.


A weird problem I’ve had for years as a musician (help?)

Alright this is gonna be a long one guys so bear with me, this is probably one of the biggest issues I face in my life (talk about first world problems lmao) and the source of monumental amounts of frustration and sadness for me, so any insight you guys might be able to give would be really helpful.

I’ll start with a bit of background info on myself, I started playing guitar around age 8 and had a lot of fun with it, and then really fell in love with music in my preteens/early teens and music quickly became the most important thing in my life, I sang and played guitar in a few bands throughout high school and started recording and producing my friends music, after a while though it became difficult to play in bands because of creative differences/finding and keeping bandmates etc so I started working on music by myself to release. It was around this time I started having a lot of trouble sticking with a particular creative direction. When I was about 18, I was discussing my issues creating music with a friend and he said to me “better be careful or you’ll wake up a 21 year old with no music to your name”

I am now 25 and seemingly in the same boat I was 7 years ago, I’ve finished and released nothing noteworthy, fulfilling or meaningful since then, I consider myself a world class expert at coming up with great ideas (only sort of joking) but I find it almost impossible to work on them to completion. Although I think most people move on by this age I still cannot imagine dedicating myself to anything other than making music and finding any sense of purpose or happiness in it, I’ve chained myself to this and for better or worse, I’m sticking with it (sorry to be so dramatic lol)

It seems like the main thing stopping me is my passion being spread too thin, one day I’m listening to some Pop Punk or Post-Hardcore bands and I feel indisputably that “that sound” is who I am at my core and I have mountains to contribute to music as a whole within that genre context, and then the next day I’ll wake up and feel absolutely nothing listening to that music, but I’ll be extremely excited about something different like Post-Metal or Vaporwave or the whole SoundCloud rap/Melodic Trap sound.

I’m always either trying to fuse many different genres into one new sound (and losing many of the things that attracted me to playing in those styles in the first place) or I’m dividing myself up into many different side projects and burning myself out. I seem unable to come up with a consistent style that i find fulfilling (or that sounds good) and I don’t just mean in terms of genre, lately I don’t know HOW I want to go about creating music.

I’ll use my most recent project as an example, it is the closest I’ve ever come to smashing everything together into something I’m proud of, it’s a mixture of electronic music and hip hop with my favorite stuff in punk/metal and acoustic singer songwriter stuff, it’s been really fun writing for it and I think I have a lot of great songs with some killer ideas but contradictions and questions like these are starting to totally kill the project:

  • How do I combine my love for both pop and progressive/avant garde music into one project? I think artists like Bjork and Dance Gavin Dance do this well in their own context but what do I do as someone who loves Blink 182 and Post Malone just as much as Neurosis and Tigran Hamasyan?

  • How “different” can the songs be from each other? Can I release a mathy Sludge/Punk/Drum and Bass song on the same EP as an acoustic pop song, and a chill trap song?

  • Where is the line between artistry and accessibility? And I don’t mean commercial accessibility either, I think mashing too much together into one project can completely destroy any sense of prominent style or identity in music and make I hard for people to connect with it or take it seriously. I don’t think anyone would really enjoy an album where one song is a death metal track recorded with a full band a produced in a rough 90’s style and the next track is a polished, quantized Chillwave song.

  • Should I produce it myself and remove elements or try to find people to work with and take much more time, money and effort for something that (to the listener) might only be a tiny difference? For example, I won’t have anything that sounds like real drums on my album unless it’s actually performed by a real drummer (with no triggers/quantizing used) so I’m trying to find someone who can set up a hybrid kit with both real drums and midi sample pads to trigger “electronic” sounding drums, so it’s still a performance on the record, but maybe I should just play a sample pad myself and only use synthetic drum sounds even though it would limit my options in the percussion department? Or maybe just get a drummer to record everything on a real kit and not worry about the percussion myself or about having electronic drum sounds... or maybe I could just program all the drums and play them pre-recorded live, or have a drummer just play the parts on a real kit live.... I don’t know man this shit keeps me up at night 0_0

  • how do I find a sound that will be both fulfilling and satisfying but also won’t become cringey and die off in a few years (see: dubstep)

  • if I do decide to smash everything together, how on earth will I market it?

These are the sort of problems that seem to come up whenever I get excited about a new project, that and the terrifying realization that once you select one of the many options before you, it becomes the only path that you’re able to take (or so it seems) I’m really envious of people who have a “primary genre” that they listen to almost exclusively (looking at you, metalheads) because it seems like they know exactly what they want to do and how to go about doing it, even sticking to one instrument is difficult for me, it seems like everything I hear shoots me in a new direction, I find myself unable to stand for something musically and as a result, I don’t create music, and this is really frustrating and crushing to me.

I debated on whether or not to post this here but I don’t really know who else to get help from, I’ve talked to a few professional musicians and even seen therapists about it but I can’t seem to get a handle on it, sorry if this was too scattered or incomprehensible, but anyone who’s been in a similar boat that could offer me some advice or anything would really help me out.


Anyone find appreciation for what Smash Mouth did for that Third Wave of Ska in the nineties?

I get that a lot of people, especially these younger kids think that Smash Mouth is just a meme but, I never saw them that way. Smash Mouth was always some of the best of the Third Wave in my opinion, at least "Fush Yu Mang" and "Astro Lounge" were; I can't speak for the rest of their discography. Fallen Horses and Flo are some of my favorites among their other big hits.


The Death of Instrumental Music?

It's very interesting to me that it seems that instrumental is dying, even rare songs like Secret Garden's Nocturne or Sleeping at Last's Saturn don't really make it high up charts or influence mainstream that much. I also find that due to the "make money" perspective, creative guitar solos are also growing very rare. What are your thoughts? Have instruments died in favor of the voice? The only place where I see them being popular is movie soundtracks, but it feels like that's more out of necessity to help set the scene.


Using a specific producer’s discography to find new music

I’ve never considered this when trying to find new artists. But recently I found out that Rob Cavallo, who I’ve known has produced most Green Day albums, also produced MCR’s The Black Parade and Paramore’s Brand New Eyes, two albums that I really like. That got me thinking. Have you ever looked at what a specific producer has worked on to find new artists to listen to? If so, who are some examples that fit this for you?


Let's talk about 12 tone serialism

12 tone serialism is a framework for atonal composition created by Arnold Schoenberg in the 1920s, the idea is that instead of using the notes of a given major or minor scale and assigning functions to each of them and their chords (i.e. common practice tonality, the musical understanding that has informed composition from Bach to Beethoven to the Beatles to Beyoncé), all 12 semitones of the chromatic scale are treated equally. The way that serialist music is composed is pretty straightforward, it starts with a tone row, the composer chooses to arrange the 12 semitones in whatever order they'd like, and has to stick with that throughout the piece, he can invert it, put in retrograde, make retrograde inversions (i.e put the tone row backward, upside down, and backwards and upside down) and can of course transpose it, notes from the row can be played in unison like chords, and single notes can be repeated but once you move onto the next note in the row you have to complete the row before coming back it.

The 12 tone technique is controversial, its criticized as being robotic or reducing music to algorithms, and many classical music fans think that it's soulless noise. Personally, my favorite atonal work is Schoenberg's pre-serialism "free atonal" Pierrot Lunaire (which is one of my top 5 pieces of music to listen to, and my favorite to play on my clarinet), but I think that 12 tone serialist music can be incredibly beautiful and musical if the composer has good taste, and awful noise if he doesn't, just like tonal or modal music. I especially enjoy the works by the second Viennese school (that is, Schoenberg himself and his students Anton von Webern and Alban Berg) and Igor Stravinsky's forays into serialism toward the end of his life.

Here are some 12 tone serialist pieces that you should listen to:

Five Pieces for Piano — Arnold Schoenberg (this is the first serialist composition that Schoenberg wrote)

Concerto for 9 Instruments — Anton von Webern

Threni — Igor Stravinsky (a 12-tone serialist setting to Latin readings from the Book of Lamentations, my church choir and orchestra performed this last year on my insistence and it's such a powerful piece of music)

Piano Concerto — Arnold Schoenberg

Wozzeck — Alban Berg (Wozzeck was the first serialist opera and it's out of this world, so incredibly powerful)

And if you're interested in hearing 12 tone serialist music from other genres, there is a nice amount of serialist jazz as well. John O'Gallagher's interpretations of Webern are a good place to start

Moderator of r/LetsTalkMusic

What Have You Been Listening To? - July 11, 2018

All weekly threads (including this one) will always be posted at 10:00 AM EST, so look out for them then.

/r/letstalkmusic is starting a fun and exciting new thread inspired by /r/truefilm. Each week a WHYBLT? (fantastic acronym if I do say so myself) thread will be posted, where we can talk about what music we’ve been listening to. The format, as of right now, is as follows.

Band Name: You must write a description of the band and what you find enjoyable/interesting/terrible/whatever about them. Try to really show what they’re about, what their sound is like, what artists they are influenced by/have influenced or some other means of describing their music.

Artist Name – Song Name If you’d like to give a short description of the song then feel free

PLEASE INCLUDE YOUTUBE, SOUNDCLOUD, SPOTIFY, ETC LINKS! Recommendations for similar artists are preferable too.

This thread is meant to encourage sharing of music and promote discussion about artists. Any post that just puts up a youtube link or says “I've been listening to Radiohead; they are my favorite band.” are discouraged. Make an effort to really talk about what you’ve been listening to.


Country Music

I feel like this is a somewhat maligned genre, probably for some legitimate reasons but also I think it might be a bit under-appreciated in the common consensus. "I like all kinds of music except country or rap" -__-

I'll be honest, I've been wanting to get into country for a long time. I'm a white American who has roots in the south and grew up in the midwest, so it makes sense, but most of my life I've been more of a fan of what I would call more cosmpolitan music, stuff highly influenced by European culture, which I would honestly consider most of the rock tradition (which maybe you could say is part of what differientiates it from country, seeing how they're both instrumentally and compositionally very similar -- drums, guitars, vocals; pop song composition). The music has never appealed to me for various reasons, but I already know there's some genius, beautiful music out there -- I've been a casual fan of Johnny Cash since I was a teenager, got pretty heavily into Neil Young a few years ago, lol the standard hipster-looking-into-roots-music fare. But I want to go deeper. I want to get at what the Carter Family were up to, what made Hank Williams Sr great, and everything in between them and the brilliance of Florida-Georgia Line or whoever like them is breaking artistic ground these days. Yep it was a joke but I did come across a guy called Sturgill Simpson who makes incredible music (recommended to me by Conor Oberst, fittingly, in his What's In My Bag episode), so I guess I'd like to tap into that vein of country, whatever that is. I just know it's a beautiful music with a lot of soul, shouldn't be neglected, especially since I think it kind of is.

So I was hoping to start a discussion about what's great in country music, those of you who have perhaps been where I am and explored, what you learned, who you found, etc. Or lifelong fans, same, what you like about the genre, why, who are your favorite artists. Is American country music ever going to have an artistic comeback or is it just twangy, beery Tin Pin Alley now and forever? Or is that even a fair way to look at modern country?

Posted by
Terminal Preppie
5 days ago

Let's talk about good or great songs ruined by one terrible choice

So I was listening to Run the Jewels' (first) self titled the other day for the first time in quite a while, and made it to Twin Hype back. "This is great!" I thought to myself, "Why was it that I always skipped this track?" That was, of course, until I got to the [horrific date-rape bit](//, that turns a kinda funny skit into a gross nightmare. This brought me to the titular question.

I mean, there's Big's "What's Beef", whose place in my mind as one of the all-time great mafioso raps is ruined by one line. [You know the one.](// While not on the same level, there's the inexplicable [blowjob bit](// at the end of Respect that goes on for so damn long, and it just... why? (I know that there's tons of 90's rap that does this, but this is the first one that comes to mind. Bragging that much about getting sex just strikes me as really sad, and really unpleasant to listen to.) I have to jump to the skip button whenever listening to my otherwise favourite KMFDM song, Waste, lest I be subjected to [the sounds of simultanous vomiting and shitting] (// And who could forget [Ventolin](//, by Aphex Twin, whose shrill ringing (intentionally, I assume) renders it nearly completely unlistenable.

That's all I got. What songs do you hate from a singular, terrible decision?


Let's Talk: Albums where the opening song is one of the weaker album tracks

The first song is customarily the best, or maybe second best, song on the album. It sets a tone and is usually more energetic than the average album track as well.

However, there are some albums where the first track is not one of the best.

Two that I can think of are "Let Me Drown" (Soundgarden, Superunknown) and "Drive My Car" (The Beatles, Rubber Soul). In both instances the opening track plays more like an average album track than an album highlight. I'm not sure that either have a huge impact on album flow, though.

What are some other examples of this that you can think of, and how do they affect the flow of the album?

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