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Original Poster1 point · 9 days ago

Looks like the kind of place where one minute you have two hands, the next one.

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Original Poster23 points · 12 days ago · edited 12 days ago

First of all, Finland did not "win" anything, so please don't use the Winter war as a cheap way to laugh at the soviets. Winter war was a truce where soviets set the terms, because Finland crawled to negotiate under the risk of immediate defeat. Finland lost the areas that around karelia without gaining the areas that the Soviets were willing to trade for them. Maybe the war could have been avoided by taking the deal or maybe not, but end result was still the same but only with finnish and soviet blood spilled for nothing. The continuation war on the other hand was just pure nazi collaborating empirebuilding with finnish consentration camps for the Russian civilians in the occupated areas. They were no deathcamps but death rates were still high because of bad prisoner conditions. And I don't think that Finland was just fighting its own war beside the nazis during barbarossa, but was fighting with the nazis. And why the Soviets demanded the landswap in the first place was because the did no thrust the finns to stay neutral if and when the nazis would break the non-agression pact and the finnish borders were right next to st. Petersburg. Finland had just been through a civil war and the white army won. The finnish whites were anti-communist and tolerated and even supported the radical fascist movements in Finland to keep the reds down. I would still say that the fighting that was mainly done out of anti-communist spite, but it is still the sum of many things.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Finland

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Karelian_concentration_camps

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriotic_People%27s_Movement_(Finland)

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4 points · 12 days ago · edited 12 days ago

USSR wanted merely and only security cooperation in the Baltic states and Finland. /s

One of the main reason Finland became eerie of the actual Soviet intentions was because they required Finland to demolish defensive structures along the eastern border, including all defensive structures on the Karelian isthmus. After the Winter War, the Soviet military relaid operational plans for a renewed offensive, but with Operation Barbarossa, the USSR required its best units and latest materiel to be deployed against the Germans. Nothing was done and the Finns advanced to the old border nearly unopposed.

Adjustable shoulder straps have a habit of "adjusting" when you don't want them to.

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Original Poster2 points · 21 days ago

They're not adjustable, the load bearing vest in question. I have no Idea what the tape is for.

Original Poster12 points · 22 days ago

On re-examination, the one on the left seems to be personnel.

88 points · 21 days ago

Swedish-Russian border partly represents the Finnish-Russian border of 1833.

This would be closer to reality. There was little consensus and enforcement until the 19th century, so understandable.

happily continued with the soviets

You dropped your /s

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3 points · 23 days ago · edited 23 days ago

Well obviously. Soviets helped against the Germans in Central Europe and then were asked to leave. He asserts both parties, the Germans and Soviets, were welcome to stay. And few people seem to agree.

He's talking about Finland, which is a much different situation than central or eastern Europe, namely maintaining independence regardless of the side they were supporting at the time.

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I mean sure Germans and Soviets were welcome to assist for the while. But not when finally asked to leave.

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7 points · 25 days ago

That's closer to how Sweden was. Finland was a de facto Soviet ally (see the Finno-Soviet Treaty of 1948 for the foundations of their relationship). Finland wasn't directly antagonistic towards the West, but it didn't maintain equal relations with both sides.

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4 points · 25 days ago · edited 25 days ago

Do elaborate on Finland's indirect hostility towards the west and its alliance/cooperation with the USSR. What were the key terms of this de facto alliance? Or was it just a type of retanaing from hostilities deal?

There was this treaty of friendship which said that Finland had to show resistance and request Soviet aid in case of an invasion by German troops in or through Finnish territory. However there was no Germany in 1948. On the other hand the treaty made it possible for Finland to remain as neutral as possible.

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1 point · 24 days ago · edited 24 days ago

The truth always twists and turns. USSR was to assist (by supplying and economically) Finland when requested and agreed upon separately in case of an invasion.

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Original Poster3 points · 26 days ago

The removed buildings were mostly made of wood. Only some of the few stone buildings from the late 18th century has been preserved. Helsinki was a poor city for a long time, and completely destroyed multiple times. Despite being founded 1550 the oldest preserved building related to the city is from 1757.

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3 points · 26 days ago

A small fishing village, that was Helsinki, wasn't really fund priority. Also, urbanization in Finland is relatively a really recent phenomena. Finland's biggest city at the time, Turku, only hit 10k in the beginning of 19th century.

Dated weapons and equipment. Doubt nuclear comes into it at all. They would be dark green if nuclear was counted.

E: dark green

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2 points · 27 days ago

GFP doesn't not take the age or quality of equipment into account. T-34 = Armata.

Also, do note; "Material presented throughout this website is for entertainment value".

See, if Estonia would register its all cars as troop transports, Estonia would be the #1 military might, unchallenged. According to GFP, that is.

10 points · 1 month ago

I was always curious how Finland had MiGs while the other Scandinavian forces had NATO and/or indigenous designs. Especially since they went from MiG-21s to being a fairly early F-18 user.

Good summary about it here.

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Original Poster4 points · 29 days ago · edited 29 days ago

In the early 60's relations between the USSR and West-Germany were deteriorating and the US was using neutral Finnish airspace to spy on the USSR. Finland was threatened by the USSR that if it would not guard its airspace they would take care of it. At the time Finland only had few subsonic British Gnat fighters which were unable to intercept the American planes. Then came the Mach 2 MiG-21s.

I wonder what Finns called themselves before Germanic or Balto-Slavic contact, if Suomi is not Finnish in origin.

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3 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

What semi-nomad stone age hunter gatherers might call themselves. Suomi referred to a territory in southwestern Finland which after the tribe there, suomalaiset, got their name. In the 15th century the nobility started calling entire current Finland "Finland" and the Finnish speakers "Finns", in Finnish also. The Finland is now called Finland Proper. The Finnic/Finnish language came to Finland around the year 500 at which point such contacts had been already for ages.

"No one was going to push out anyone." Now you're just playing loose with reality. Thats exactly what happened. Swedes have been incredibly marginalized in Finland since the time of this poster.

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6 points · 1 month ago

In general, Fennomans and Svecomans had no intentions of removing any group. Don't know about ethnic Swedes, but Swedish speaking Finns might be the most pampered minority anywhere. Such gets strange looks from abroad.

You're acting like a silly person. I already said many of the agreements were good but they still haven't prevented the swedes turning from 20% of the population to today just being 5%. In large part because of aggitation from the finns. And my point was that if the Svecomans had "won" the culture war or atleast gotten more favorable terms. This wouldn't have happened in reverse because of the population at that time being 80% finnish. Read before you respond this time.

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3 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

What changed was the granting of equal opportunities. Had Svecomans won and the population stayed backward, a dim future would wait. This would have even led to 0% Swedish speakers in Finland as they would have had a much brighter future to the west.

This was done mostly by the Swedish speakers. What language you speak is your own choice, you will have the same prospects. Swedish in Finland had been in decline since the 1800's/1600's when there were little to no opportunities in Finnish.

Fennomans were for change and Svecomans against change. Svecomans became to existence just to counter the Fennomans and the change, the granting of equal opportunities. The Svecomans having "more favorable terms" means fewer opportunities for the population. I don't see how this would be better in anyway.

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Original Poster-2 points · 1 month ago

The closer language of Finnish is Hungarian (thus Finno-Ugric origin the both Hungarian and Finnish). Their relatives stayed in Siberia

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42 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

Vast majority of Finno-Ugric languages are west of the Urals, from where they also stem, that is Volga-Ural. Not Siberia. Finnish is to Hungarian what French is to Nepali.

is that soviet ww2 120mm mortar?

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Original Poster6 points · 1 month ago
2 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

120mm ? It says 81 right on the sign

EDIT: It seems like the mortar is actually 120mm but i have no idea why they have the sign for 81mm up.

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Original Poster10 points · 1 month ago

The 81mm on the left is not in the frame.

1 point · 1 month ago

Yes, it's from German gewalt or Swedish våld or välde. Finnish word for state, "valtio", is also based on the same "valta", power.

Source (in Finnish): http://www.kysy.fi/kysymys/mista-tulee-sana-vakivalta

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3 points · 1 month ago

From Proto-Germanic waldą.

27 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

we certain this is Finland? The young man on the right seems to have the Nazi eagle and swastika on his helmet.

Am I missing something about the Continuation War, here? Were there German soldiers fighting with the Finns in Finland? I suppose 1944 would put this late in the war when scattered German units might have been forced into Finland by advancing Red Army troops, but I am unsure...


instead of downvoting can you answer my question? freakin reddit....never ask anything on this damn site

thank you for all the comments restoring my faith in redditors

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Helmets from the right clockwise: German, Hungarian, Italian and Swedish.

Is this from this year in Finland or an older picture?

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Original Poster1 point · 1 month ago

The former.

Original Poster29 points · 1 month ago

Well, I learned english around 5-6 years old, but the thing is, Swedish is Finland's second official language, so it's your right as a citizen to recieve any public service, whether it's health care or legal help or anything, in swedish. English is not one of Finland's official languages, so while nearly all finns do speak english, public offices aren't legally required to hire people who are fluent in it.

Fenno-ugric languages are also a completely different language family than scandinavian ones, and absolutely do not resemble each other in any way. Someone who speaks german can kind of pick up a few words of swedish here and there, because a lot of the words are similar-sounding, while finnish is grammatically completely different.

Let's say colours, in german, swedish and finnish:

Green: Grün - grön - vihreä

blue: blau - blå - sininen

yellow: gelb - glu - keltainen

red: rot - röd - punainen

You see what I mean? Comparing german to swedish is like comparing a wolf and a fox. Comparing swedish and finnish is like comparing a fox and a seagull.

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3 points · 1 month ago

The above depends whether the language is official in the region. Otherwise It cannot be demanded.

Original Poster8 points · 1 month ago

Alright.

But english is still not one of Finland's official languages.

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3 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

That is true. Yet it is required in more jobs than the second official language by far.

The civilian deaths from starvation and disease were regrettable but there's no evidence that it was intentional.

i've heard that theory multiple times and it does not correlate well with the dispersion of the death rate through the years. At the early stages of the war, while the Finns strongly believed into the Nazy victory, imprisoning into Finnish camps was as good death sentence. As it's became obvious the Axis is facing defeat, and surrender is imminent, conditions in the camps suddenly became nearly luxurious.

refused to send Jews to Germany

It's simply not true. The Finns made the exception for own Jewish citizens, but captured Soviet Jews were routinely sent by Finns into the German death camps.

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Conditions in the camps stayed largely the same (miserable) throughout the war as Finnish capacity and agricultural output (70% of labor was at the front) did not magically expand. The war and operations were expected to last a year, or otherwise a conducted exit. Years of idling and tens of thousands of prisoners were not prepared for.

We discussed this already in the previous thread.

onditions in the camps stayed largely the same (miserable) throughout the war

It's not. The difference was raised up to absurd level. We have evidences that POWs captured on final stage of the war didn't want to return home. They are, in numerous cases, filed for permission to stay in Finland, as their living conditions in the camp was so much better than their normal life in USSR.

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These were POWs who were sent to host families. By "filing for permission to stay in Finland" you mean filing for citizenship? Camp capacities (spaces, bunks, health care and etc) may have increased due to the prolonged war, but hunger and diseases were still raging (89% of casualties happened in 1941 due to a famine). Overall conditions in the camps stayed largely the same, miserable.

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Original Poster22 points · 1 month ago

Note, the town was never actually fought over during WW2.

Original Poster2 points · 1 month ago · edited 1 month ago

Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe, that is.

Edit: Dammit wikibot.

The Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE) is the world's largest security-oriented intergovernmental organization. Its mandate includes issues such as arms control, promotion of human rights, freedom of the press, and fair elections. It employs around 3,460 people, mostly in its field operations but also in its secretariat in Vienna, Austria and its institutions. It has its origins in the 1975 Conference on Security and Co-operation in Europe (CSCE) held in Helsinki, Finland.

The OSCE is concerned with early warning, conflict prevention, crisis management, and post-conflict rehabilitation. Its 57 participating states are located in Europe, northern and central Asia, and North America. The participating states cover much of the land area of the Northern Hemisphere. It was created during the Cold War era as an East–West forum.

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